Tried the new war game yet? (Kebir Blue)

well, i think the last interesting part of the game has been eleminated. the new war levels makes declaring war on a c3 a losing proposition unless you're a newby. in the past it was one of the few ways to make a little extra money, but now there's little incentive to declare on c3's. also, it's my guess that the same thing will apply to declaring on registered players. and you won't be able to declare on inactives either if they're not at your level or above.

i fear that the game has degenerated into a game for neebs only and the rest of us will snore into oblivion until our memberships lapse.

another victory for socialism.

No. This was W3C responding to player requests. This was a players idea and other players put in their input. It may just be a good idea on paper but bad once you realise all of the drawbacks. I don't think people thought about how this would affect raiding inactives.

The lesson W3C needs to learn is that they can't quick fix the problems here.

The lesson players need to learn is that our ideas aren't always very good.

W3C needs to fix this. The REAL way people go from noob to war ready is by attacking INACTIVES with swag to get the resources (cash and GC) and experience with weapons they need. Making C3s more difficult was just a way for them to sneak an anti-C3 war agenda through.

yep, level three which is where i started has fourteen helios/interceptor squadrons. targets are all small garrisons. it wouldn't be that hard to take but with all the forts and only 400b cash and 2.5t in corps, it's not worth it. i'd probably spend at least that if not considerably more to take it down. bummer. and yes, i agree with you about the rush to fix something that doesn't need fixing or at least not in the manner taken.

LOL I just had the funniest eyedeer!

Why evan Make this? Its so pointless, And i can tell why

1. C3s when they are usally taken for a number a reasons, And one of those reasons are to expand your empire, Well, When i took my first c3, I dident destroy any corps or anything, And it was losing almost -10b a month - all the costs to repair it. Within 1-2game years, It was already in debt 2.5T. And it took a very long time to get it to stop loseing money. Basically what im sayin is that Not only is there a chance that it will cost u in the future, That the costs of ammo and weapons to take the country, Will just make it evan more expansive, And make you lose Evan more money!! for a country that might not evan be put together right.

2. Warring on countrys with presidents. I think that is so stupid. Iv heard things about "New players getting there countrys taken from them" and that is a problem, Well, 90% of those new player in there 21 day peroid evan keep playing, If th

Repeal? Vote in Public Voting.

Thank WB. I think he claimed responsibility for this insanity in his own words on another thread.

Find a link on the forum that shows a Whiteboy post, and send him a "Thank You Dumbazz" for his blessings.

Parsi, BC - Yeah, can't say I get the complaint...the system has been implemented for not even 24 hours and from the experience I just had works perfectly which I was quite surprised by.

You guys are taking an extremely limited view of 'how does this affect me' instead of how will this affect the game overall. Under the system the way it was, *SHOCKING NEWS* - no one was learning the war game, they'd learn how to take a c3 and probably pretty ineffectively and that was it. An entire part of the game that used to get players really interested and actually kept a lot of players here (the war game and the federations that came with it) was effectively dead. From that point, there were 3 options:

1. Eliminate war, make the game econ only - some players lobbied for this, I think it's an honest perspective but ultimately I believe the game would die without war (check the forums lately?)

well, atm, i believe i'll at least break even on the first hasty L3 c3 i've taken. i'm optimistic that further expanse of tactics, will make it profitable, perhaps in time, we'll be able to make more profit off of high level c3's?!?

honestly, i enjoyed fighting a c3 of higher difficulty, i really did. however my biggest complaint, is their seems to be special tweaking to the weapon/ammo levels of c3's, i mean, they get good Q to shoot at you, but seem to be degraded when you get in and loot. although, i could be wrong about that, and any units on the map, still disintegrate, after victory, i really wish, that if we find a way to win with out destroying those units, considering the extra cost... give us something to loot!!!

How come I am -1 war level?

Cant even dec a C3!

LOL

Orbiter,

we will look into the war records of your recent war. if you give us the name of the country involved, and world, it will make it easier to find.
There was no change to the way the war actions are executed but C3s at different levels do have different quantities of ammunition.

We will look at what happens to the remaining units when the war is won and check this "disintegration" you mentioned. I know that there is indeed a closing process. It is inherited from the previous C3 war process and I am not sure if it was updated to fit the new situation.

We are also running more such wars to measure the cost and damage.
If you have more data, please give us names of countries and the world where it happened. This will allow us to tune the numbers.
The entire process is table driven and can be tuned quickly. This will be done, based on facts and recent experiences.

Whiteboy

Same story. Please give us details so we can look into the war.
Depending on what happened in these wars, we might decrease or increase the differences. we have also yet to decide at which level you will start winning War Level awards.
This too will depend on the war process, the cost and the remaining assets.

Serpent,

You cannot declare war on a C3?
did you try?
can you give us some details on this.
You should be able to declare anytime and start immediately independent of your war level.

tom...

thanks for the response!!!

The Grand State of Fonetta, on lu, is atm, the only one i've conquered

as i stripped the garrisons, the quality levels went down... so the garrisons where holding lower quality weapons than the country itself was??? i'm happy with fighting nice quality c3s but i should also be able to loot the same Q i'm raiding? right? but like i said, i'm not sure, that the weapons in the c3 shooting me were 120q or 100q, its a hard judgement when their are only 15 aamb...

as the "disintegration" any unit in a c3, (sense the changes from the old war engine,) are unavailable upon conquest... meaning, if you manage to take a c3 with out destroying the int wings, they are unavailable to disable and own...

previously, that made sense, but now, it seems that you should allow us to dismantle old wings, and "loot," them

i edited the above post to add that its hard to tell the difference between 100 and 120, when their is only 15 aamb...

i still don't like the level restrictions on attacking players, you should be able to attack any one that that can effect you, in game (including boycotts, and sc resolutions,) but that said, if we can flesh out this thing about c3s right, then i'll be ok...

Sorry Tom, I wasn't clear. I didn't have any issues. I do agree with Orbiter, it would be nice if units/garrisons remaining that were not destroyed were kept in the country to make it so that one could at least make a small profit/break even on the higher level c3's though.

Overall, I tried the system once and it worked impressively smoothly. I was quite surprised and impressed that I didn't encounter any issues considering just how big of a change this must have been.

Good job to you and the dev team for a very smooth big change.

Yep....just took a level 4 C3 and the remaining army units disappeared. The Democratic Union of Chelonia on LU.

Will this be standard protocol....that they disappear, or will we eventually be able to break these units down ourselves?

Would surely help offset the cost of taking the C3. No way I'm even breaking even on this one.

Is this also part of the desired intent....to eliminate C3 stripping in it's entirety? There is virtually no value in them now considering the costs of breaking the air defense alone.

Also, I had the C3 half painted and the capital, and cities destroyed before the war index even budged. Is this delay to be expected?

Thanks for your time Tom,
EC

i have to agree with wb, good work, really, just give us something worth looting, and everything will be ok, in reguards to c3 levels, anyways

not asking for much, in "looting," but it should be worth the effort, anyways, carry on

Useless feature. Nothing to discuss. Send it down the tube for everyone's sake.

Don't get me wrong WB, I think it was a good idea, but the implementation sucks, and that's because W3C gave us what we asked for.

As for noobs learning from raiding, I believe that's true for most people because 1.) you get swag, so there is an incentive 2.) that swag GIVES them the resources they need to buy more (which is a large part of going from noob to battle ready) 3.) it gives you a chance to test what you've learned without a chance to lose, so you can get the feel of how to attack, how much it takes, how long it takes, etc. while taking down an actual defense (not always, of course) 4.) attacking C3s has no rewards and (I'm guesing) are not setup with the same sort of defenses one would be going against when fighting experienced players, though higher war levels could prove this wrong. Still, the incentive is not there.

I could go on but I've got to go to work. Bott

currently, there are limited ways to build and maintain an empire. even taking numerous c3's creates a situation where a new player most often ends up deeply in debt. so, the logic of raising c3 fighting levels doesn't hold true. how many of us have witnessed a newb take down a dozen or so countries in a short time, amass huge debt and then leave the game. it seems that w3c, in an effort to control players being able to amass huge empires is cutting off every means of doing so. only by investing more gc's can one maintain and build an empire under the system as it's evolved over the past couple of years.

the intent of protecting new players from seasoned players who raid those new players might be helped by making c3's more desirable to take. if you want to keep levels as they are for c3's raise cash to 3-5t and weapons to 5-10t for a level three or 4. raise those levels commensurately as you move up the levels. d

BC and Parsi - I get what you guys are saying but it seems the argument you're making is that everything was working great and the game was doing well under the system the way it was...which we all know isn't true. No one was learning the war game, nubs were bailing in masses and as Barren pointed out, most of the time before they even reached the end of their waiting period. If it was the case that players were identifying c3 raiding and inactive taking as the best and easiest means to develop their empires then we would see a lot more activity and players than we do now.

People like to compete in games, SC offers several ways of doing so, HOF, FI ranks, leveling up and what was at one time the biggest competition, wars and federations. The war game has died over the past year or so, I don't know how anyone can really dispute that. This system offers the best chance to revive it while giving players something extra to compete for

wHY ARE YOU ALL TYPPING LETTERS, NUMBERS AND PUNCTUATION MARKS!? wHY? why!?!

I don't think anybody here believes the system was fine the way it was. I've argued for a while that it needs a complete overhaul to compete in 2010. I don't think War Levels addresses the root of the great problems SC has and I think removing inactive raiding causes a huge effect on how players can develop in the game. The only problem that I can see this addressing is the C3 war issue.

LOL

Vote for repeal you do nothing congress members!

Check your public voting and cast a vote up or down.

WB the system may not have been optimal as it was before the changes. But the changes have only served the purpose of making c3 taking almost pointless and expensive without an incentive.

That *IS* what you wanted. So of course, this great and works wonders, for you and possibly only you.


However this in no way protect a newbie from attack or raiding. It does present an entire host of other issues.

How does this promote participation in federations?

How exactly does this protect a small or big inexperience fed from being wiped out by a few experienced players?

How does this benefit any part of the game overall?

What this will do is encourage more players to get higher war levels with even still yet inadequate experience and a c3 will in no way whatsoever p

We have now looked into 4 wars against c3s of Level4. These are all the wars we found this morning.
There are big differences and we will check all of them.
the shortest took 79 attacks, the longest about 450.

As I said this morning, we will look into the remains of the C3 army and the disintegration as you describe it.
I also said that there will be GC awards for higher war levels. This will be part of the next update that will go up to level 8 or so.

Looting involves more clicking. we think that GC awards will be a better way but a combination of the two may win.

I agree that there must be a strong incentive to fight these wars, for beginners and everyone else.
Technically, creating such an incentive can be trivial. we just need to decide on the best way to do it, at which levels, etc. but a strong incentive will be there.

The wars at higher levels will be different as the C3s will fight back. We do not