| Wednesday, September 16, 2015 - 10:43 pm |
Anyone know the answer to the following:-
Why i cannot set a consistent quality for (any / all) supplies that corps require?
The process in which i attempt to achieve this is :-
Corportations Tab at top - Manage Corp - Supplies
Toggle which corps require the quality needed.
In the box for 'Preset - Default Requested Quality' i put e.g. 300. Press copy to selection.
Save Order Quantities and Quality button clicked at button.
Next time i check it, back to blooming 180! Highly frustrating when i need quality of 300 for Offensive Wep Corps.
| Thursday, September 17, 2015 - 03:09 pm |
I'm not 100% sure about this. An engineer is looking into it.
Will post again when I know more.
| Thursday, September 17, 2015 - 04:40 pm |
Appreciate the response Jonni.
I look forward to your reply.
| Monday, September 21, 2015 - 10:15 pm |
Any update on this please Jonni?
Country in question is 'The Kingdom Of Heaven'.
Have already mailed gamemaster.
| Monday, September 21, 2015 - 10:22 pm |
This is the same issue I posted to the Problems Forum here:
It is related to when you get the message:
Real Date: 20-09-2015 19:13:29
World Date: August 05 3489
Subject: Government Salary Reduction
Message: AWG3 has high debt and is making losses. The salaries of all government workers have been reduced.
AWG3 then had supplies changed to 180 qua and sell strats changed for all state corps. It seems too easily triggered. AWG3 had over $11 Trillion cash, no debt, over $10 Billion profit, and a finance index of 163 for that month.
| Tuesday, September 22, 2015 - 01:02 pm |
I received this type of message on and off. It is quite common, I am in SC too long to even bother to write.
The problem I had similar was salary. When I tried to increase salary from 300 to 350, next thing I realized were the salary remains at 300.
My corp was Noble Group.
| Tuesday, September 22, 2015 - 10:10 pm |
I haven't had any slave countries for 2 days now, still happening.
Any GM able to look into this please? I have 4 weapon corps that i cannot contract to myself due to low Q.
| Friday, September 25, 2015 - 02:28 pm |
Apologies for the long wait. We've been unable to reproduce this problem at all.
@Sunnyknight I just logged into your country to see if it might have been related to your country.
I just set your requested quality to 300 and it seems to be sticking.
Please let me know if this happens again.
| Friday, September 25, 2015 - 04:08 pm |
Jonni-on-the-Money. Glad to have a capable GM. However imho any supplies @ more than 220 is just a waste of $ - only good to increase score via Common Mkt. @ corleone452. I haven't run across that problem yet, and you run a nice CEO. Maybe it correlates with Gov. salaries somehow? IDKnow.
| Friday, September 25, 2015 - 06:15 pm |
Hi Jonni, back to 180 again.
Will set to 220 and see what happens.
| Friday, September 25, 2015 - 07:18 pm |
annnnnnnnd back to 180.
| Friday, September 25, 2015 - 08:59 pm |
Maybe someone can answer this question.
Why do corps use more that 3-4 up to 8 months stock of materials when production is only at 124%? Seeing it is about 25% difference shouldn't it be like 1/4 of a months use?
Between this issue and the Automatic Cash Transfers wiping out my cash I am getting tired of this game.
| Saturday, September 26, 2015 - 12:19 am |
Huh Steve ?
What you said doesn't make sense, of course over 100% production will use more than 100% of expected use. Re-post clearer if you have a genuine question/problem.
| Saturday, September 26, 2015 - 01:00 am |
I have corps at 124% production that are using up to 8 months of materials in one game month. That figure should be 1 & 1/4 of a months supplies not 8 months worth. Clear enough for you to understand my question?
1 months usage 100,000
Next month used over 800,000 at 124% production
I am not at 800% production so it is impossible to have used all of the materials needed to bring back to max of 120 months in stock
| Saturday, September 26, 2015 - 02:08 am |
Now another thing is happening that I need to question. Why are profitable corps still with 100% or more production not producing the same amounts of products? Production still at the same level but not producing the same amounts as last month. Slight differences can be expected but I am talking major quantities so easily noticeable.
| Saturday, September 26, 2015 - 05:32 am |
An example corp, or corps, is needed to answer these supply questions and the production question likely involves needing an understanding of country and corp welfare, though, again, an example and supporting data would make this clear.
| Saturday, September 26, 2015 - 10:05 pm |
A corp in question.
Welfare @ 120
Any other information needed? I would LIKE to send all production to my country, The Kingdom Of Heaven, but as such, the quality is too low. I just let it sell slowly on the market until Effectivity is 200 and Quality is 200.
Supplies just DONT stay at any figure i set for a month.
| Monday, September 28, 2015 - 01:44 pm |
Oke guys. It took a while to figure this one out. The engineer responsible for developing the complex market system was away and I was not aware of how the backend for this works.
Here is the gist of it.
requested quality for corps is indeed limited to 180. This is done because there is no hard limit to product quality.
The soft limit to product quality is defined by the input quality of products and the quality upgrade level of corps.
Without this limit, you can see there'd be a feedback loop that would infinitely increase product quality. Theoretically infinite product quality would cause enormous costs and an unstable (unsustainable) economy.
As it stands there is no point for corporations to ask for more than 180 input quality because the resulting output quality wouldn't bring any benefits with it.
Countries work differently since they don't use high quality products to produce even higher quality. Because of this countries can request any quality level and reap the benefits from it.
We are currently discussing if we can change the way this works because it is a little opaque. It would however be very complicated to do so without causing this quality increase loop I described.
| Monday, September 28, 2015 - 01:49 pm |
Thanks for your input Jonni.
However, if the quality is indeed limited to 180. then shouldn't the manual ordering of supplies for corps also be limited to 180?
As it stands, after looking into a few other eco countries and their corps, i could see that people could order up to 260Q for their supplies?
Is this just a automation issue, or a wider issue that needs to be rectified / balanced?
| Monday, September 28, 2015 - 03:33 pm |
Jonni, please be careful of those changes. Sorry, but I would differ on how supply quality benefits corporations, at least currently, in the game. I would welcome additional data but my analysis is supplies of at least 210 quality, and maybe very slightly higher, continue to offer benefits to corps.
I used several corps of differing supply qualities for a comparison. My goal was to choose corps producing the same product with a stable market price. I also wanted to attempt to average the data over a year period to minimize other varying factors. In an attempt to limit salary or welfare influence on corporation performance, I examined data in a way that would remove their influence by focusing on raw materials cost and data per unit. The lack of yearly/unit production data forces one approximation. The three corps purchase supplies at 180 qua, 210 qua, and the last averages over 260 qua.
Here were my findings:
Bubbles Building Materials
Ordered Supply Quality 180
Products Sold Last Month 2,653.46M SC$
Production Last Month 2,447,069.87
Products Sold Last Year 31,621.75M
Raw Materials Used Last Year 13,452.95M
Approx Units Sold Last Year 29,171,356
Approx Material Cost/Unit Last Year 461
Unit Sale Price - Material Cost 623
Navajohill Building Materials
Ordered Supply Quality 210
Products Sold Last Month 3,193.04M SC$
Production Last Month 2,564,943.94
Products Sold Last Year 38,691.37M
Raw Materials Used Last Year 17,713.81M
Approx Units Sold Last Year 31,077,405
Approx Material Cost/Unit Last Year 570
Unit Sale Price - Material Cost 675
Bottrop Building Materials 260+ (Several Products Contracted)
Products Sold Last Month 3,325.71M SC$
Production Last Month 2,507,001.66
Products Sold Last Year 39,561.48M
Raw Materials Used Last Year 21,139.86M
Approx Units Sold Last Year 29,812,720
Approx Material Cost/Unit Last Year 709
Unit Sale Price - Material Cost 618
My findings show that corp 1 sells its product for $623 over the cost of materials, corp 2 $675, and corp 3 $618. This would indicate to me that somewhat low (corp 1) and very high (corp 3) supply strategies are not as optimal as a supply strategy with a purchase quality of near 210.
| Monday, September 28, 2015 - 03:47 pm |
I looked for the last GM comment on this issue.
Where Andy recommended "The best quality for corporations is around 200. "
| Monday, September 28, 2015 - 06:53 pm |
Could i also point out, that i cannot set the corp supplies to 'ANY'. It changes the next month.
I don't think this is a market quality limit, but a fundamental problem within my country.
Could this be looked into please Jonni? or is it going to be the crying chore of manual ordering?
Country name is The Kingdom Of Heaven
| Monday, September 28, 2015 - 09:22 pm |
I differ on these supply values. @ 220 supply quality I produce at 269, 303, and 330 product quality depending on corporate upgrades. @ 180 I don't believe it, though it would save money. If I see it I'll believe it. I'll be the first to drop my supply quality if this works. Does anyone get this product quality buying supplies @ 180? I'll gladly buy the beer.
| Monday, September 28, 2015 - 09:51 pm |
Aries, maybe just because your strategy is ordering 180 or 210, can you be sure this is the average quality you are getting and so using.
My experience is I tend to get an average slightly less than the generalised overall ordered quality. Heck, even with contracted supplies you cant guarantee they will be exactly what you expect.
Maybe, if you have the inclination, do a little spreadsheet to find your true supplies quality being used and final output quality ? I would expect that if Jonni says there is a hard cap of 180 then that IS the cap.
| Monday, September 28, 2015 - 10:05 pm |
I was clear that corp 1 orders at 180 and that corp 2 orders at 210. The quality delivered is typically close but, as you said, not exact. That said, the exact quality of the delivered product is viewable on the corp pages and it is clear that there is a difference between these corps in the quality of supplies used. This has a predictable affect, as I have shown, in the cost of supplies being higher for the corps using higher quality supplies as well as the ability for corps to demand a higher price for their produced, higher quality, product. I don't see additional data as being needed to show this but, as I have said, I welcome additional data and analysis.
| Wednesday, September 30, 2015 - 01:05 am |
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| Wednesday, September 30, 2015 - 11:13 am |
An example of another player still able to order supplies at 220+ for all of their corps in the country, state owned corps.
Why am i not able to do this?
@Jonni, please update.
| Wednesday, September 30, 2015 - 03:48 pm |
There was no recent change at all.
there was a recent question so we looked into it (again).
This subject was discussed several times in the past and remains debatable.
The reason for a limitation, as Jonni already said, is to protect corporations against overspending that does nothing to improve their revenue.
The output quality depends on the quality of the used products and the upgrade level of the corporation.
If you could use input quality 400, the output quality could go much higher and nobody will ever buy your products or even worse, the trading system might crate a compromise price to find a deal and your revenue will end up much lower.
The best solution to the problem of extremely high quality products proved to be the prevention of escalating quality that causes heavy losses to corporations and countries.
We will look into it again and see if the settings are good in all cases and may come with some different results in specific cases.
The general idea however remains the same and it is unchanged from day one this game is running. It was tuned several times in the past years. Not recently, we saw comments in the source, dated to 2011 and 2012.
I do not think anyone could claim the last word here.
There are major differences in the way the game economy works, compared to the real one,
One of them is the rigidity of the use of raw materials.
In the real world there are many alternatives and millions of products.
Another is, that in the real world, there is a market for a wider range of qualities and there are more, and different factors involved in the quality of products.
| Wednesday, September 30, 2015 - 07:54 pm |
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| Wednesday, September 30, 2015 - 10:33 pm |
Good to see you here Mom.
| Thursday, October 1, 2015 - 09:36 pm |
Maybe someone can answer how a corporation can use 8 to 10 months of materials/supplies in one game month? I am not at 800% production capacity and this is so annoying it is making me think it is not worth even playing anymore.
| Monday, December 21, 2015 - 01:56 am |
I'm having the same problem in "The Evil Empire" on Golden Rainbow.
Something I noticed, and may be the reason the GMs can't duplicate the problem, is that it resets to 180 at the turn of the month. Set it on the 20th, and it changes back to 180 on the 1st. Set it on the 6th, and it changes back on the 1st.
So what you're looking for only happens on the 6 busiest moments of the day.
| Tuesday, January 26, 2016 - 04:48 pm |
I have been having a very similar problem as SunnyKnight only in my case I cannot set my corp default supplies quality so anything lower than 180. After a few hours the default quality is back to 180 automatically. I'm on GR.