It sort of is a problem with the people you are talking about, both of you. See youwillfall, what you see a lot of here is young girls, and I mean 16 or even younger, having children so they have to be housed by councils, and then they have a further child because they want a bigger apartment/house, often with a different father, and the cycle spirals. They cant work for poor education and having maternal responsibilities, those that do take responsability for their offspring (not a large enough proportion), the children grow up with no moral upbringing and the cycle starts again.
Obviously there are many different issues that drain resources, tourist healthcare, black market cheap labour, immigration etc. etc. etc.
But how do we determine which individuals do need state help, and which are just...lazy? That would require individual case assessment, and how would we do that, one case worker for each claimant? Lord knows there&
J
James the fair (Little Upsilon)
All worlds
AT LAST finally someone who understands me where i'm coming from, I knew I could count on you Crafty and me and you know damn well it's happening all around us, does'nt the riots we had this year telling you theres something seriously wrong with this society? because I don't think it will be the last riot either, not by a long, long way away.
Like I said before, i've tried helping them out and it did'nt do me any good, 'I'M DONE' with such at that lot.
J
James the fair (Little Upsilon)
All worlds
Anyway what do you think of the recent Eurozone crisis we have in Europe?
Y
youwillfall (White Giant)
All worlds
why would someone steal if they didnt need to.
and i highly doubt young girls are having kids just so they have a place to live its rediculus.
why there was a riot is a complex issue, what i read seemed to be the starting of the "occupy" movment with some hooligans mixed in, people feal theyve been pushed to far and no one is happy, so somthing has to be done.
i dont buy the whole it costs to much thing either, if the government didnt the people who need it couldnt afford it. so the alternative is increased crime by nessesity (everyones gotta eat somehow), leading to more police, more jails and the cost go even higher. it mainly comes down to do you want to throw them in jail or give them some help. jail typicaly costs way more, and leads to a less productive society.
now systems to get abused but i dont think it is as widespread as you's think, reducing abuse is defenetly a tricky issue to solve,
Y
youwillfall (White Giant)
All worlds
i must say though i am defenetly enjoying these forums they make you think in ways you never had before and i think both sides tend to come away with a better understanding of each others veiwpoints, at least i am, and its staying civil which is awsome, i never get to have a discussion about these topics that isnt i agree or your the devil
J
James the fair (Little Upsilon)
All worlds
it mainly comes down to do you want to throw them in jail or give them some help. (your quote)
It's obvious which one i'm going to say, I say make them work in the prisons, they will actually be a lot productive by being in prison, that's just where you're wrong, they will have to pay for what they've done, it sounds like you're just a do gooder trying to justify yourself who is more than happy to let them get away with it and allowing them to do it again on the streets. making prisoners work for free is a great way for them to get rehabed as good people like me and Crafty will be able get really cheap goods at good quality on the open market, knowing it's not an import, everybody wins, or thats how it should be, which I know right now it is'nt.
Y
youwillfall (White Giant)
All worlds
ok then take the current situation economy is bad to the prisoners stop working so "hardworking" people can keep theyre jobs? if not they get laid off cant find annother job and get forced into crime to they get thrown in jail to start working again this time for free continueing the cycle.
this is a big issue ill post about later i have to go back to work
J
James the fair (Little Upsilon)
All worlds
hmmm.... yeah you've got a point there, but they don't all get forced into crime, mostly good, decent, usually middle class families move out of the cities where theres no work then move to other places where there is work to be had (which has happened a lot), but in this country it mainly depends on the social class and personality of the person whether eventually that individual commit crimes or not.
I also heard about a huge prison on a TV programme once, I think it was a state prison in Louisianna in the United States, where the governor there makes his prisoners work, whether it's repair work, farming or general production, in a quite fair manner as when I saw it on TV I thought it was great what they were doing, so really you could say slavery is still going strong, even today, but only to those who are bad in society.
C
Crafty (Kebir Blue)
All worlds
<!-Quote-!>Quote:and i highly doubt young girls are having kids just so they have a place to live its rediculus.
<!-/Quote-!>
Sorry dude, but they most certainly do. I know several people whose kids boast about the ways they defraud the system. Its a major problem here in the UK says the govt. and they keep trying silly solutions that end up costing more and more admin'.
J
James the fair (Little Upsilon)
All worlds
I know one personally who did exactly that just to get away from her mother, she's got 2 kids and shes only 18 years old and livng in a council house rent free, which I think is a national embarassment and shameful to our once great nation.
Hey Crafty, I just wondering if it's possible to sign a petition and get over 100000 signitures about it? just like what happened with EU referendum.