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Forum War & Peace Attack drones and Fighters

Attack drones and Fighters

C
Crafty

All worlds
07 Nov 2012 12:00Link
Actually, Jonnis statement that the defense points at the stronest weapons in the attacking unit would make sense of what is happening. I would suggest this is what has changed, maybe before the defense didnt differentiate between different weapons in a unit?
G
Gaz

All worlds
07 Nov 2012 19:33Link
Yes I picked up on that but why doesn't the GM just come out and say yes they've changed it. Instead of being all cryptic about it.

I always did think it unrealistic not to loose fighters.
C
Crafty

All worlds
07 Nov 2012 19:42Link
Gaz, probably because it's an unforeseen/unintended result of some change made, hence they are not really aware of it or say nothing has changed.
G
Gaz

All worlds
07 Nov 2012 19:57Link
Well they are now :)

It's worked that way for so long though you'd think they'd know the side effects.

Andy/Jonni can you's give us a yes or a no? Do you's intend to fix this or not?
K
Keto

All worlds
07 Nov 2012 21:22Link
If thats the case, then the GM needs to remove all the useless weapons!
G
Gaz

All worlds
09 Nov 2012 20:07Link
Then there'd be only a hadfull of systems left lol.

Is the GM ingnoring this or what? This is BS if you ask me. Drones have been getting used as shield for years and they've got very little to say about it ffs. This should be game news as it's a major change. Glad I dont have my old empire were I had millions of them.
S
SweetPea

All worlds
09 Nov 2012 23:43Link
...
S
SweetPea

All worlds
09 Nov 2012 23:44Link
<!-Quote-!>Quote:

As far as I know Attack Drones were never intended to work as shields.<!-/Quote-!>



This is one of the most basic aspects of the war game. You have to take down air defense before doing anything else if you are fighting a c3 or a pvp war.

Jonni's statement is about as shocking one could expect.
S
Samsin Valiga

All worlds
10 Nov 2012 04:16Link
want to know what confuses me???!!!

i send out 10 attack drones on an attack mission

unfortunately they got destroyed

which caused 13 casualties!!!???

which means that for every DRONE shot down i lose atleast 1 soldier sometimes 2 how does that work out i thought drones were unmanned but apparently they are manned..and sometimes by two people
C
Crafty

All worlds
10 Nov 2012 15:22Link
The silence from the GM is totally unforgiveable on this one. Jonni and Andy have both said there is no change, whereas the players assure them that there is.

Its not good enough to ignore this and hope it goes away Andy. You may feel as though you have answered it already but not to anyones satisfaction here. Just saying 'nothing has changed' does not alter the fact that is HAS. You must be able to find and see the cause, so could we have an acceptable response please, and a reason why this was not declared in the game news.

PS @ samsin, I think you'll find the thinking behind it is that the ground crew that operate the drone get killed.
A
Andy

All worlds
10 Nov 2012 15:56Link
No change to drones at all and no weapons have ever been designed or introduced to the game as shields. defensive ones are used to destroy attackers, offensive ones, like drones, hardly so.

you may have discovered some way they seem to behave under some conditions but they don't destroy interceptors.

This discussion started with an assertion that drones attacked interceptors.
Drones never attack any other airplanes. never did.
we stated this before.

the number of drones lost, depends on the exact composition of the defense, and its quality, fed member unit within range or not etc.

quality is an important issue of course.

Please explain what the problem is, taking into account the facts as described here.

You can check the weapons document, to see what each weapon does against any other weapon but quality is assumed equal.
G
Gaz

All worlds
10 Nov 2012 18:35Link
Nobody ever said drones shot down interceptors. It's the fighters mixed in with drones that shot them down. The drones were bait as they were targeted first by the interceptors. Its been this way for aslong as I can remember. Now they ignore the drones and go for the fighters first. I cant make it clearer than that. It,s got nothing to do with quality you guys must have change the targeting system somehow?
A
Andy

All worlds
11 Nov 2012 14:42Link
If you want a good response, make sure you explain the problem.

Again. No changed priorities and no changes in weapons for a very long time.

The defense attacks the weapon it considers most powerful (or dangerous).

This could be the drones (potential damage per drone, quality of the drone and its ammunition, number of drones, number of missiles used per drone per attack) compared to the same for each weapon.

Next attack may be treated differently if the numbers changed as a result of previous attacks and the responding unit might be a different one if it is deemed more effective in the case of the new attack.

I do not know the composition of your previous attacks and the composition of the defense in previous attacks.

Unit sizes are smaller now than before, (all of them are smaller), and quality may play stronger now with more weapons and ammo upgraded across the worlds.
C
Crafty

All worlds
11 Nov 2012 14:53Link
Exactly. It would appear that previously the defending interceptors attacked the attacking drones and the fighter planes at the same time, so less fighter planes were lost in the first hit but several drones were lost. Several interceptors were killed by the fighter planes, then I presume the next round of calculation (is it 6 per attack?) would have a greater number of planes left to kill a greater number of interceptors as the interceptors would target the drones and FP again. And so on.

The final result being far more favorable to the attacker in terms of FPs lost to destroy an interceptor wing than if a wing of FP alone launched the attack. Of course it would cost many drones but this was calculated into it and the losses in terms of $$$ were still favorable.

Now the interceptors do not seem to target the ADs in the initial attacks, they go straight for the FPs, and only attack the drones when the FPs are destroyed.
C
Crafty

All worlds
11 Nov 2012 15:10Link
I see the clause "A weapon that has no effect on a target is not included in the process. The weapon does not participate in the attack and does not take losses." This would explain why the drones are not targeted because the attacked target is normally a town or counties defences and they have no garrisons (C3s) hence nothing for the drones to attack so the war machine ignores them.

However, drones have been used in this manner for as long as I have been in the game and they always did act as 'shields'. Maybe the change came about by changing the targets that drones are effective against?

I have no idea...just trying to help you see what has caused this change.
S
SweetPea

All worlds
11 Nov 2012 15:43Link
Yeah, apparently you can't target a few things with drones. When you do the news comes up as weapons were not effective in the attack line, for example in some extreme cases I used them to destroy corporations, but they seem to have no effect now. Could be the same for cities and towns and so on, but I have not tried that.
S
sbroccoli

All worlds
20 Nov 2012 13:56Link
That message comes up even if the weapon does actually do damage the target, but very marginally. Maybe a rounding error?
N
nix001

All worlds
20 Nov 2012 23:18Link
How about a quality issue? I'm can't be bothered to do a test as I have already changed my weapons to deal with this change in the war engine. Maybe, because of the greater influence of quality in the game, if your fighters and ammo are greater quality than the attack drones the interceptors hit the fighters first?
C
Crafty

All worlds
21 Nov 2012 23:35Link
If the FP and AD are in the same unit then the quality of the unit should be an average. There should be no distinction between the two weapons quality.

The only explanation I can see is that the targets drones are effective against has been changed.

It would be really helpful of the gamemasters to refute or confirm this.
A
Ashur Banipal

All worlds
09 Dec 2012 20:18Link
I used them last night and they worked. The ADs took hits while FP destroyed DIWs.
G
Gaz

All worlds
09 Dec 2012 20:30Link
That's good to hear.
M
Michael VII

All worlds
07 Jan 2013 12:16Link
Another option is to first attack with drones only, when that attack is finished; then launch the fighters in a second attack.

Is that too simple to work?
M
Mizore

All worlds
07 Jan 2013 13:02Link
*facepalm*
C
Crafty

All worlds
07 Jan 2013 22:46Link
But Ashur, what were you attacking? It makes a difference as to if the AD attack or not and hence take int fire and absorb the punishment.

Michael - you completely miss the point.

Mizore - Be nice, lol.
S
SweetPea

All worlds
08 Jan 2013 17:26Link
Lol Mizore.

I can't confirm Ashur's results. Just a few days ago I fought a c3 and to my dismay, fighters were being targeted in a fighter/drone combo wing.

It surprised me because I was getting used to using a high quality wing around 250 fighting quality and losing about 25 planes per attack. Seemed easier than recreating wings that get creamed because you have less weapons actually attacking an air defense wing with combo wings. Losing drones is ideal but if that is not happening, just go with a 500 fighter wing at a decent quality. And please, never use bombers to shield, that is just disgustingly wasteful given these weapons are no longer traded on the open market and have to be produced by players.